The Oath with Chuck Rosenberg

The Oath with Chuck Rosenberg is an interview show about public service, told through the careers of the people who did the work. The episodes begin with the oath of office itself, a promise to support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic, which ends on a repeated 'So help me God.' Then Chuck Rosenberg introduces a single guest. His questions often start well before the career does. He introduces Patrick Fitzgerald as a legendary federal prosecutor in Manhattan and the son of parents who immigrated from Ireland, and his first question is about growing up in Brooklyn in a family of four children. The introduction to 'Patrick Fitzgerald: The Right Thing' lists what the conversation covers: efforts to dismantle the mafia, the 1993 World Trade Center bombing, the 1998 embassy bombings in Kenya and Tanzania, the indictment of Osama Bin Laden, and Chicago's struggle with violent gangs and public corruption during his time as U.S. Attorney there. Counterterrorism comes up again and again. In 'Robert S. Mueller III: The Director (Part 2)', Rosenberg asks about the pressure inside the FBI to let agents join overseas interrogations that used methods the Bureau never used. Mueller explains the decision to prohibit it and stresses that it was made jointly, because it involved a whole institution. In 'Matt Olsen: The Line', the guest calls the people detained after the United States went into Afghanistan a mixed bag: a small number of serious terrorists such as Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, some Taliban officials, and a large block of low-level fighters, many of them from Yemen. In 'Frank Figliuzzi: The FBI Way', the guest explains how a double agent operation works, including the choice an adversary faces between rejecting the person as a trap and taking the risk. This is specific, procedural talk. The guest list also goes well beyond badges and courtrooms. Carla Hayden talks about librarianship and about meeting Mr. Rogers, who she says was just as nice and gentle in person as on screen. She also remarks on how many women in librarianship have gone by three names. Carrie Hessler-Radelet describes how Peace Corps service passes between siblings, aunts, uncles, cousins and friends, and how professors help recruit the next generation of volunteers. Rosenberg brings his own history into these conversations. Talking with Mueller, he says that working for him and at the FBI was one of the great professional privileges of his life. With Hayden, he sounds plainly delighted that she got to meet Mr. Rogers. The Mueller interview is labeled Part 2, so that conversation runs across more than one episode. For the counterterrorism thread, the Fitzgerald episode is a strong place to start, since it covers everything from a Brooklyn childhood to the Bin Laden indictment. The Hayden episode shows the show at its warmest. In both, listeners hear people describe the decisions they made in their own words, drawn out by courteous, curious questions.