The How NOT To Make A Movie Podcast · A L Katz

S4E11: It's Magic?

March 25, 2025·57 min·1 clip

When Terminator 2 proved CGI was the future, I switched from movie effects to hands-on magic.

This episode features host Alan Katz interviewing professional magician Wes Eisley and his wife Natalie about building a life and career in magic. Eisley, who famously fooled Penn and Teller on their show *Fool Us*, discusses his craft alongside Natalie, who is also his stage partner. Wes Eisley's initial career ambition was to work in practical special effects makeup, inspired by Tom Savini and the movie *FX2*. His perspective shifted after seeing *Terminator 2* and predicting the industry's move toward CGI, which led him back to his childhood passion for magic. He grew up immersed in movies while working at his father's video store, which relied on adult film rentals for profitability. Eisley studied marketing in college to learn how to monetize magic, resisting conventional jobs after witnessing his brother's dissatisfaction with factory work. A pivotal moment was fooling Penn and Teller with an original trick involving a half-dollar coin and full audience participation. Penn loved the routine so much that he later paid Eisley a significant sum to learn and perform it permanently. The Eisleys now run a family-oriented magic show, sometimes incorporating their three children, and perform everywhere from libraries to casinos. They emphasize that successful magic relies on craft, storytelling, and relentless practice, not supernatural elements. An interesting insight is that many technically brilliant magicians remain amateurs because they lack marketing and business skills. Eisley notes his promotional strategy includes securing local TV appearances to build lasting credibility. The couple met when Natalie was a waitress and Wes was the house magician at an IHOP that hosted magic nights. Natalie initially hesitated to date Wes due to their height difference, but their connection overrode that concern. The conversation reveals the tension between creative passion and parental worry, as Wes's mother initially wanted him to pursue a secure career while his father supported his early gigs. Alan Katz relates by sharing how his own surgeon father never fully understood his writing career, despite serving as a medical consultant on *Tales from the Crypt*. The episode has a warm, conversational tone, blending personal storytelling with practical discussions about the business of entertainment. Listeners interested in the behind-the-scenes realities of creative careers, the ethics of magic, or heartwarming entrepreneurial stories will enjoy this episode. Those seeking a highly structured debate or deep dives into specific illusion techniques might find it less focused.

As heard by us

A backstage magic story that cares as much about the grind as the trick.

The episode leans into backstage magic with a clear eye for the odd little machinery around the Penn and Teller Fool Us chance, the friend who sends the tip, and the awkward business of proving a trick without ruining it.

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Why you'd press play

You want the real fuss behind a Penn & Teller win.

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