What Gives? The Jewish Philanthropy Podcast · Jewish Funders Network

Dr. Keren Fraiman and Dr. Sivan Zakai - The Future of Israel Education

·53 min·3 clips

Educators name four barriers: context, difficult conversations, emotions, and “who will have my back?”

1. What Gives? The Jewish Philanthropy Podcast episode centers on Israel education and how Jewish children learn about Israel before college. 2. Host Andres Pocoyni speaks with Dr. Keren Fraiman of Spertus Institute for Jewish Learning and Leadership and Dr. Sivan Zakai of Hebrew Union College, who both received the Ilya Salita Excellence in Research Award. 3. The core question is whether Jewish education should transmit a narrow love of Israel or create space for children to build nuanced understanding. 4. Zakai describes the Children’s Learning About Israel Project, a longitudinal study following children from kindergarten through middle school. 5. She also discusses the Learning and Teaching About What Matters Project with Dr. Lauren Applebaum, which tracks how Jewish children think about current issues after October 7th. 6. Fraiman says her research on educators shows a gap between children’s curiosity and adults’ reluctance to teach the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. 7. She lists four recurring barriers: not enough contextual knowledge, not knowing how to handle difficult conversations, fear about students’ emotions, and lack of institutional backing. 8. Zakai says the transition into kindergarten is when many children first describe Israel as a place of violent conflict. 9. She says second grade is a pivot point when children move from general ideas about conflict to specific stories about real people and events. 10. Zakai notes that in Florida, New York, Texas, and California, children in both supplementary schools and day schools share concern about the hostages. 11. She also distinguishes between high-knowledge children who read headlines and low-knowledge children who only sense that “bad stuff” is happening. 12. Fraiman says educators she studied across Hillels, summer camps, day schools, and supplementary schools reported the same reticence regardless of geography. 13. She adds that today’s students bring similar questions because information is “so easily accessible” on their phones. 14. Pocoyni argues that earlier generations could hear difficult truths about Israel because love and solidarity were presumed to be secure. 15. Fraiman responds that learners should be trusted more and that a “thin relationship” with Israel cannot withstand problematizing. 16. Zakai distinguishes between transmissionist and constructivist education and says most classrooms contain both impulses. 17. Pocoyni presses the idea that solidarity should work as concentric circles, with care for family, Jews, and humanity existing together. 18. Zakai answers with developmentally specific language, including “kol Yisrael areivim zebazet” and “two Jews, three opinions,” and says younger children handle these ideas more serially. 19. The conversation is direct, analytical, and occasionally adversarial, with long back-and-forth exchanges rather than polished soundbites. 20. Listeners interested in Jewish education, Israel education, and parent-school dynamics will get the most from it, while people looking for a light or brief discussion may skip it.

As heard by us

A serious listen on Israel education that leaves room for broad inquiry.

This conversation between Dr. Keren Fraiman and Dr. Sivan Zakai tracks how Jewish children learn about Israel before college turns the question sharper.

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Why you'd press play

You want a serious guide to teaching Israel before college classrooms become the first place kids meet hard questions.

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