294: Putting the "I" in Change, with John Fisher

·46 min·4 clips

John Fisher reveals why people book a second counseling session but never show up, tying it to a hidden emotional impact.

Andrea hosts John Fisher, a constructive psychologist and coach based in northern England, on the Voice of Influence podcast. Fisher begins by describing his background, transitioning from working on aircraft radar systems to project management and eventually psychology due to a preference for people over technology. He introduces George Kelly's personal construct theory from the 1950s, which posits that individuals interpret the world through filters based on past experiences and that the client, not the therapist, holds the answers. Fisher explains how this constructivist perspective empowers personal agency, contrasting it with traditional psychoanalytic approaches. The discussion shifts to change resistance, where Fisher shares his 'theory of second no show' from counseling work, linking it to Elizabeth Kubler-Ross's bereavement curve and emphasizing that change involves loss and identity threat. He applies this to business contexts, noting how people in toxic jobs or facing new technologies may feel defensive. Fisher then describes his adaptation of the change curve for organizational settings, highlighting its non-linear nature and trap doors like denial or hostility. He explores communication strategies for change, stressing that organizations change through people and that engagement is key. Fisher introduces the ABC technique by Finn Shudy, which assesses advantages and disadvantages of current and future states to identify barriers. The conversation touches on honoring the past during change to avoid resistance, using analogies like house-moving parties. Andrea and Fisher reflect on practical applications for leaders and change agents, with Fisher advising trust in oneself as a core message for influence. The episode concludes with Fisher sharing his website and LinkedIn for further resources.

As heard by us

John Fisher frames change as a loss of identity and agency, giving leaders a more humane way to understand uncertainty.

Leadership development often talks about change as a process to steer. John Fisher gives it a more personal charge, treating it as something that can feel like loss.

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Why you'd press play

When change feels less like progress and more like losing a familiar version of yourself, you may want John Fisher in the room.

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