User Defenders – UX Design & Personal Growth · Jason Ogle

User Research War Stories with Steve Portigal

·1 hr 34 min·5 clips

Steve Portigal explains why suppressing your instinct to speak is the key to uncovering deeper user insights.

Welcome stays ceremonial. After the sponsor message and superhero framing, Jason Ogle brings Steve Portigal into a warm conversation about research without turning it into a performance. The first lesson is patience. Portigal says interviewers should not panic if rapport is not there right away. Trust can show up later, after the interviewer keeps paying attention. So keep listening. Ask follow-up questions. Stay curious enough that the person being interviewed can feel the room shift toward them. Jason sounds genuinely delighted when an idea lands. He reacts in the moment, then turns that little spark into a useful question for Steve. Ethnography is where the episode tightens up. Jason asks what the word means and why Grant McCracken warned that questionable practitioners have damaged the area. Steve answers carefully, calling ethnography a kind of third rail word because people are quick to challenge whether a project has earned the label. The term comes out of anthropology, and Steve explains that it points toward writing about a culture. That makes it easy for critics to push back when research work uses the label loosely. The terminology debate does not feel like trivia. It gets at how language changes credibility, expectations, and defensiveness around research. Jason keeps the whole thing loose, with a caveat, a laugh over pronunciation, and enough space for Steve to interpret Grant without pretending the answer is neat. Even when the episode turns methodological, it stays grounded in respect for participants and humility from the interviewer. The close returns to the show's community rhythm: Jason asks listeners to share takeaways, mentions Steve Portigal and User Defenders on Twitter, thanks the sponsor and artwork contributor, and signs off with the familiar call to fight on.

As heard by us

A patient interview about rapport, ethnography, and listening long enough for better answers.

User Defenders episode 49 brings Jason Ogle and Steve Portigal into a steady discussion of interviewing, ethnography, and the patience needed to build rapport. The episode makes a simple case well: connection does not need to land at the opening.

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Why you'd press play

Press play if you want smarter user interviews without the jargon armor.

Read the full recommendation in PlayNext →

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