Trump Archives - KDA Keeping Democracy Alive Podcast & Radio Show · Burt Cohen

Plato: The Benefits of Acting Justly

·58 min·5 clips

Plato saw tyranny as a form of anarchy, and Melissa Lane argues Trump's insurrection attempt fits this ancient diagnosis.

This episode of the Trump Archives - KDA Keeping Democracy Alive Podcast examines Plato's political philosophy and its relevance to modern American democracy. Host Bert Cohen interviews Princeton professor Melissa Lane about her book "Of Rule and Office: Plato's Ideas of the Political." Lane argues that Plato's ancient insights on governance, office-holding, and tyranny are directly applicable to contemporary political crises. Plato's central work, "The Republic," is a dialogue about constitutional government, originally titled "Politeia." Lane explains that ancient Greek regimes existed on a continuum between oligarchy, based on wealth, and democracy, with Athens granting citizenship to free men. She details how Greek democracies implemented audits and legal procedures to hold officials accountable, including financial reviews and public defenses of conduct. Plato's philosophy addresses the recursive problem of "who will guard the guardians," questioning how to oversee those in power. He proposed stringent constraints on rulers, including limits on property accumulation and family benefits, to prevent corruption. The discussion applies these concepts to the modern U.S. Supreme Court, contrasting its recent ethics code with Plato's stricter ideals for unaccountable guardians. A surprising claim is that the Greek goddess of justice was depicted as clear-sighted, not blindfolded, emphasizing the need to see reality clearly. Lane connects Plato's thought to Niccolò Machiavelli's later republican work, "The Discourses," which focuses on making virtue effective to preserve liberty. She analyzes former President Donald Trump's actions through a Platonic lens, suggesting that fomenting an insurrection could be seen as an abdication of office, creating a state of "anarchy." Plato's Allegory of the Cave is presented as a metaphor for political denial, applicable to various groups invested in comfortable falsehoods. Lane also references Mary Trump's psychological study to illustrate Plato's argument that a tyrant's narcissism leads to profound unhappiness and isolation. The conversation links ancient concepts to modern events, such as the January 6th Capitol riot, where participants re-described anarchy as freedom. Plato viewed true freedom as existing within the rule of law, not in rejecting all rules. The episode has an educational and conversational tone, blending philosophical exposition with direct political commentary. The host and guest engage in a thoughtful dialogue that moves from ancient texts to current headlines. Listeners interested in political philosophy, classical history, and its application to modern U.S. politics would find this episode compelling. Those seeking a purely historical analysis or who are averse to critiques of specific contemporary figures might choose to skip it.

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