The Splendid Table: Conversations & Recipes For Curious Cooks & Eaters · American Public Media

836: Italian Two Ways with Chefs Joshua McFadden and Christian Petroni

·50 min·4 clips

Chef Joshua McFadden creates a meat-like ragu using toasted nuts braised in tomato sauce.

Francis Lam opens by treating Italian American food as one of the country's national cuisines. That frame moves the conversation away from a generic pasta lesson and toward a more personal argument about taste, texture, and the way pasta actually eats on the plate. Joshua McFadden makes a firm case for dry pasta. He says fresh pasta has its place, but he reaches for it more with dumplings and with sauced dishes that want wider noodles like tagliatelle or pappardelle. He pushes back on the idea that fresh pasta is always better. For him, linguine and clams or spaghetti with tomato want a dry noodle because the texture changes the whole dish. Texture keeps coming back as the main point. He talks about how much more there is to teach people about cooking dry pasta well, especially the details around saucing and timing. The conversation does not stay abstract. It moves into gluten-free pasta and how far the category has come, enough that in some settings it can be hard to tell at first. McFadden remembers expecting it to be bad. He describes being won over by a great chef in an Italian restaurant and coming away impressed by how much the product has improved. Francis keeps pressing for specifics. He asks what brands stand out and how the better versions behave once they cool, which keeps the discussion practical instead of nostalgic. The show then shifts toward Christian Petroni. Petroni brings the episode back to a classic tri-state comfort dish with his chicken scarfiello recipe. That change gives the hour a second register. It moves from pasta technique to a specific regional dish that feels grounded and familiar. The result is a conversation that moves easily between technique, substitution, and the everyday appeal of Italian American cooking. It leaves you with a sharper ear for texture and a clearer sense of why certain dishes simply work.

As heard by us

A warm pasta conversation that keeps texture and technique at the center.

Francis Lam treats Italian American food as part of the country's national table, then keeps the focus on dry pasta, texture, and the practical case for gluten-free pasta when it is the better fit.

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Why you'd press play

If you debate dry versus fresh pasta, this episode gives you grounded ammunition.

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