Trump’s Plan for Gaza (with Antony Blinken)

·1 hr 10 min·5 clips

Former Secretary Blinken admits Trump's Gaza plan is essentially the one his team left in a drawer.

Former U.S. Attorney Preet Bharara hosts former Secretary of State Antony Blinken for a detailed interview recorded on September 30th. The episode focuses primarily on Trump's newly proposed peace plan for Gaza following the Israel-Hamas war. Blinken immediately notes that the plan's basic framework was developed by the Biden administration and left for the Trump team. He expresses cautious hope but outlines significant trap doors, including whether Hamas will accept it and if Israel will fully implement it. Blinken applies journalist Tom Friedman's rule to analyze Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu's support, suggesting listeners ignore English statements and focus on what leaders say in Hebrew to their own people. The discussion delves into the mechanics of negotiating with Hamas, which occurs through intermediaries like Qatar and Egypt, not directly. Blinken explains the changing dynamics of Hamas's decision-making authority, which shifted to Doha after a leader in Gaza was killed. Bharara asks Blinken to predict the situation 48 hours later, but Blinken demurs, noting the process will take weeks. The conversation shifts to American public opinion, citing a New York Times poll where the percentage of Americans believing Israel intentionally kills civilians rose from 22% to 40%. Blinken calls the poll devastating for Israel's standing. He recounts a nine-hour argument with Netanyahu early in the conflict to allow humanitarian aid into Gaza. Blinken argues that Israel's failure to provide a political alternative to Hamas is a fundamental mistake, perpetuating conflict. Bharara poses a thought experiment on whether Netanyahu could have handled the war differently, but Blinken suggests societal momentum made change nearly impossible. The interview then pivots to Ukraine, analyzing Trump's recent positive comments about Zelensky after previously berating him. Blinken interprets this as a potential statement of U.S. withdrawal, contingent on continued European support using frozen Russian assets. He defends NATO's Article 5 as a critical deterrent. When asked if dangling NATO membership provoked Putin, Blinken firmly states the invasion was about Putin's belief that Ukraine is part of Russia, not NATO. The final segment examines the United Nations. Blinken quotes Dag Hammarskjöld, saying the UN's purpose is not to lead to heaven but save from hell. He cites UN aid agencies and its role in a Yemen ceasefire as examples of utility, while acknowledging a checkered peacekeeping record. Blinken gives Putin, not Trump, credit for NATO members increasing defense spending. The episode concludes with Bharara's post-interview segment answering listener questions about grand jury procedures in the James Comey indictment case.

As heard by us

A sober look at Gaza's postwar future, where diplomacy depends on making a political alternative credible.

The episode frames Trump's latest Gaza peace proposal as less a headline than a test of what comes after the fighting. Antony Blinken, described as Joe Biden's 71st Secretary of State, ties it to a post-conflict plan he says was developed with all parties and left for the…

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You want a Gaza peace proposal explained by the former Secretary of State who says his team helped develop its post-conflict framework.

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