Relationships at Work - a trust-driven leadership podcast · Russel Lolacher

When Leaders Mean Well — and Still Get It Wrong

·1 hr·5 clips

Dr. Joel Perez reveals the three characteristics that make up cultural humility for navigating workplace complexity.

Dr. Joel Perez, an executive coach and author of "Dear White Leader," joins host Russell Lailker to explore cultural humility as a leadership posture. This episode examines how leaders can navigate workplace complexity by moving beyond performative diversity checklists. Dr. Perez defines cultural humility as a continuous practice built on self-awareness, addressing power imbalances, and fostering systemic change. He contrasts cultural humility, seen as an ongoing posture, with cultural competency, which he views as a foundational but often static starting point. Dr. Perez shares a personal story of being fired from his first job after graduate school, which taught him about resilience and disentangling his identity from his work. He argues that identity, including facets like race, gender, and faith, should be leveraged as a "superpower" for leaders. The conversation details a coaching example where a leader named Tim learned to engage an employee by consciously acknowledging his own whiteness and unearned privilege. A key insight is that cultural humility requires leaders to give up certainty and be comfortable with ambiguity as demographics and societal norms shift. Dr. Perez recommends tools like the Intercultural Development Inventory (IDI) for building self-awareness and checking biases. He emphasizes that this work is not about eliminating accountability but creating environments where creativity and calculated risk-taking can flourish. The discussion warns that leaders who cling to a command-and-control style may face a "watershed moment" forcing them to reevaluate their real power. When leaders inevitably make mistakes, Dr. Perez advises a simple, non-defensive apology without demanding forgiveness or immediate education from the harmed party. He stresses that vulnerability must be purposeful and modeled by leaders to encourage team members to share their own experiences. The return on investment for this work, he suggests, manifests over years as employees feel genuinely valued and accepted. The tone is educational and conversational, blending personal anecdotes with actionable coaching frameworks. Leaders and managers seeking practical strategies to build inclusive, psychologically safe teams will find this episode valuable. Listeners looking for quick, checklist-based solutions to organizational culture may find the emphasis on continuous, personal work challenging.

As heard by us

A plainspoken look at cultural humility, bias, and the work of making belonging real.

Russell treats cultural humility as a working habit for leaders trying to build belonging and psychological safety. The point lands because he does not flatten culture into one neat category; he keeps coming back to the fact that workplaces are shaped by subcultures that vary by…

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You want a grounded take on cultural humility before your next leadership meeting.

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