Pulling The Thread Podcast: Tracing Jesus Before Christianity Emerged, Jesus the Jew within Judaism! · Jeramiah Giehl

Deconstructing Messianic Myths: Exploring Disparities (Past Leaders Discuss Mashiach & True Judaism): Episode 22

·1 hr 27 min·5 clips

Deuteronomy 13 says a claimant can be dismissed if the promised results do not appear.

The episode opens with the host introducing an interview with author David LeBlanc, a former Calvary Chapel pastor and Messianic leader, and Richard Cortez, a former Messianic pastor who converted to conservative Judaism and is now in the process of converting to Orthodox Judaism. The host also puts his own past in the Messianic movement on the table as part of the setup. The discussion quickly moves to the idea that Judaism and Christianity are mostly alike. That claim is rejected as a serious distortion. Richard Cortez says the conversation has to begin with Tanakh. The thread that holds the episode together is peshat, the plain sense of the text. That is set against the habit of reaching for esoteric readings too quickly. The point is not that mystical interpretation has no place, but that it belongs deeper in the study, not at the start. The host says one of the most frustrating habits in the Messianic movement is treating nearly every phrase as a hidden reference to Jesus. The guests call that approach amateurish and out of step with Jewish learning. They argue that sound study begins with Torah, moves through Talmud, and only then reaches more complex interpretive questions. In that order, a skilled rabbi handles mystical argument carefully and with context. The conversation keeps returning to boundaries. Judaism is not simply Christianity with a different confession. The group treats that distinction as central, not cosmetic. They also tie the issue to the way Messianic or Christian readings can flatten Jewish learning for Christian ends. The tone stays skeptical of that reduction, but it does not turn against Jewish tradition itself. As the discussion develops, the guests argue that the Messianic framing often misreads the sources it claims to honor. They say it does not teach authentic Judaism and does not reflect what Jesus, if he existed, would have done. That critique opens into a broader defense of historical reconstruction. Textual criticism, historical scholarship, and archaeology are presented as tools for getting back to the plain meaning of history. The host closes by thanking the guests and recommending the discussion to viewers who want more of the same kind of exchange. The episode lands as a study in how insider memory, Jewish learning, and historical method can challenge inherited Christian assumptions. It is less about scoring points than about resetting the ground the argument should have started on.

As heard by us

A measured look at why Messianic readings can miss Jewish context.

It keeps the focus on a basic question: whether Judaism and Christianity really sit as close together as they are often said to. The conversation brings in a former pastor and Messianic leader, a former Messianic pastor moving from conservative Judaism toward Orthodox Judaism,…

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Why you'd press play

Press play if you want a serious reset on Jesus, Judaism, and Messianic claims.

Read the full recommendation in PlayNext →

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