Holy Heretics: Losing Religion and Finding Jesus · The Sophia Society

Jaded: A Reckoning with White Evangelicalism w/ Marla Taviano

·1 hr 4 min·5 clips

Marla Taviano explains how she believed a loving God was doing atrocious things to make her holy.

This episode features host Gary Allen Taylor in conversation with author and former evangelical Marla Taviano. Taviano, known online as White Girl Learning, writes about deconstructing white evangelical Christianity and anti-racism. She discusses her journey from a fundamentalist background to her current perspective, heavily influenced by Black womanist scholars and authors. Taviano grew up in a loving but theologically conservative white evangelical home and attended a Christian college. She credits writer Rachel Held Evans with giving her permission to ask questions she had previously suppressed. Her deconstruction led to a deep dive into her 62 personal journals, revealing internalized toxic beliefs about God and self-worth. She explains her book *Jaded* is a "poetic reckoning" specifically with white evangelical indoctrination, not Christianity as a whole. The stylistic choice for poetry came from carving down prose to its essence, making it accessible for shorter attention spans. A key insight is her realization that her former "love" for neighbors was framed by seeing them, and herself, as "wretched sinners" destined for hell. She connects white evangelical theology directly to historical and current injustices, including slavery, lynching, and mass incarceration. Taviano describes using her bitterness and anger as fuel for advocacy, sharing a poem titled "guns > kids" in response to school shootings. She argues that deconstruction requires listening to Black, Indigenous, and other marginalized voices to expand one's understanding of faith. The conversation touches on the tension between sustaining righteous anger and maintaining personal health in the face of ongoing injustice. Taviano advises against trying to argue directly with entrenched opponents, instead focusing on amplifying marginalized voices and creating beauty. She notes her unique position to speak to white evangelicals because she once held their views for four decades. The tone is a candid, reflective dialogue between two people with shared evangelical backgrounds. The style is conversational and personal, weaving in readings from Taviano's poetry and specific anecdotes from her life. Listeners who are deconstructing their faith, interested in the intersection of race and Christianity, or seeking a personal narrative about leaving fundamentalism would appreciate this episode. Those uncomfortable with critiques of evangelicalism or discussions of systemic racism might choose to skip it.

As heard by us

A blunt, humane look at what evangelical certainty can leave behind.

The episode turns evangelical certainty into a quiet reckoning, using poems and journals to sit with the split between serving a loving God and feeling punished by the faith that was supposed to hold everything together.

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Why you'd press play

When you want a blunt, post-evangelical conversation about evangelical harm, press play.

Read the full recommendation in PlayNext →

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