Bringing Light Into Darkness - News & Analysis · Bringing Light Into Darkness - News & Analysis

Does NATO Promote Global Stability or Promote War & Conflict (07/15/24) (Part 1/2)

·25 min·1 clip

Swanson says the United States leads in treaty rejection, opposes the ICJ and ICC, and keeps almost all foreign military bases on Earth.

1. Bringing Light Into Darkness on KOOP 91.7 FM centers this July 15, 2024 episode on NATO, U.S. military spending, and the phrase “rules-based order.” 2. Host Pedro Gatos interviews David Swanson, Executive Director of World Beyond War and Campaign Coordinator for RootsAction, because Swanson has written War Is a Lie and When the World Outlawed War. 3. The episode asks whether NATO promotes global stability or promotes war, while Gatos frames the discussion with SIPRI spending data, Pentagon audits, and U.S. lobbying. 4. Gatos cites William Hartung’s estimate that the United States accounts for 40 percent of world military spending, and he notes SIPRI’s 2023 figure of $916 billion. 5. Gatos also brings up the Pentagon’s sixth failed audit and the claim that it could account for only half of its $3.8 trillion in assets. 6. Swanson says “rules-based order” is a phrase used by Joe Biden and argues that it is not a legal framework like international law. 7. He says Biden’s NATO-centered approach operates outside the rule of law and presents U.S. preferences as global rules. 8. Swanson argues that NATO’s charter pretends to honor the UN charter while giving members a way to justify wars as defensive. 9. He says none of NATO’s wars have actually involved defending against an attack or threat to a NATO member. 10. Swanson lists Bosnia, Kosovo, Afghanistan, Libya, Iraq, Gaza, and Ukraine as examples of wars NATO has normalized or supported. 11. He says the United States is the leading holdout on major human rights and disarmament treaties. 12. Swanson also calls the United States the leading opponent of the International Court of Justice and the International Criminal Court. 13. He says the U.S. is the leading user of the UN Security Council veto and the leading shredder of treaties it has signed and ratified. 14. Swanson points to Guantanamo as a “lawless island” on stolen Cuban land and says the U.S. keeps almost all foreign military bases on Earth. 15. He says the U.S. puts nuclear weapons into six European countries in violation of a nonproliferation treaty. 16. Swanson argues that NATO helps legitimate weapons buildup by turning military spending into a civic duty measured as a share of GDP. 17. The tone is argumentative and dense, with Gatos pressing broad geopolitical questions and Swanson answering in long, rapid-fire sentences. 18. The format is a host-led interview with interruptions for station identification and a mid-episode pause for the cause. 19. People interested in antiwar politics, NATO policy, and U.S. military power will get the most from it. 20. Listeners looking for a short, lightly edited interview without strong opinions may skip it.

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