Bedeviled: A Podcast about American Democracy from Duke University · Duke University Sanford School of Public Policy

The Erosion of Democracy: "Much Quicker Than Expected"

·26 min·2 clips

Before Trump's presidency, Daniel Ziblatt warned he might pull America toward authoritarian government—now his worst-case scenario is unfolding.

This episode features host John Harwood interviewing Harvard professor Daniel Ziblatt, co-author of "How Democracies Die," on the state of American democracy three months into Donald Trump's second term. Ziblatt's earlier warnings about democratic erosion now appear prescient to the host. The conversation assesses whether current developments are temporary or represent a permanent systemic change. Ziblatt states the current situation aligns with the "worst case scenario" outlined in his book. He details Trump using government machinery against critics, including news organizations and law firms. The host cites specific actions like stretching executive power for deportations and terminating congressionally authorized programs. Trump has also targeted universities and suggested ignoring adverse court rulings. The discussion compares the U.S. trajectory to other countries that have drifted from democracy. Ziblatt analyzes these actions as a potential departure from the American system known for over two centuries. A key insight is that the erosion is unfolding "much quicker than expected." The episode examines the concept of democratic backsliding through a comparative, historical lens. The tone is analytical and conversational, grounded in academic perspective. It is educational, focusing on political science and historical parallels. Listeners interested in political science and comparative democracy will find this episode compelling. Those seeking light entertainment or partisan political debate might skip it.

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